Discussion:
Deployment Strategies
Brian Vallelunga
2007-02-13 02:32:15 UTC
Permalink
Lizet Pena de Sola
2007-02-13 14:21:16 UTC
Permalink
Mark Aurit
2007-02-13 18:29:08 UTC
Permalink
I suppose the corporation I work for is not unlike everyone elses -
there is some major paranoia going on with dst.
Im working on an app that uses some calendar controls, just brought one
up in vs.net 2.5 - and noticed an "IsDaylightSavings" property. Please
tell me this wont be an issue - both at the ide and framework level. Im
hoping neither use internal algorithms, instead depending on the OS.
That makes it someone else's problem (whether one exists or not).
Thanks, Mark
> ===================================
> This list is hosted by DevelopMentor(r) http://www.develop.com
>
> View archives and manage your subscription(s) at
> http://discuss.develop.com
>
> ===================================
> This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com
>
> View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com
>
>

--
====================
Mark Aurit
***@gmail.com

===================================
This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com

View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com
Dean Cleaver
2007-02-13 18:58:07 UTC
Permalink
Stacey Levine
2007-02-13 19:18:30 UTC
Permalink
Dean Cleaver
2007-02-13 19:21:23 UTC
Permalink
Stacey Levine
2007-02-13 19:24:14 UTC
Permalink
Dean Cleaver
2007-02-13 19:33:26 UTC
Permalink
Rich Armstrong
2007-02-13 22:00:23 UTC
Permalink
phil paxton
2007-02-13 23:59:08 UTC
Permalink
On 2/13/07, Rich Armstrong <***@msn.com> wrote:
> >> ... not the least of which is an IsDaylightSavingsTime
>
> If your TimeZone class derives from System.TimeZone, I hope you didn't really
> give the method that name. System.TimeZone's method is named
> IsDaylightSavingTime. :)
>
> Ah - I see the problem. Coming from a country with 1 time zone makes you
> a little blind to these types of issues, however I guess I do have
> software running across 4 different time zones now which is why it all
> runs based on UTC - have had the time zone and daylight savings issues
> before.
>
> If it's any help, I'll offer my TimeZone classes [1] - basically, it's a
> something I wrote a few years back to read all the time zones from the
> registry, and there's a couple of functions in there (not the least of
> which is an IsDaylightSavingsTime which takes a datetime and returns a
> bool). You can select any timezone from the collection it builds as
> well.
> Dino

I haven't looked at the code [yet], but do you cover those time zones
which are just plain wacky? (places which are 15' different than a
time zone it abuts?)

The last startup I worked for needed comprehensive time zone coverage
and I remember it was a *very* complex scenario (world-wide).

p

After my earlier explanation of Indiana's DST issues, I forgot to
mention my prank which I never put into play.

I was going to suggest Microsoft was fighting DST in Indiana because
they'd have to create & test patches for all of the Windows products
(at least in Indiana) in order to accommodate the various time zone
changes. It's obviously flawed to technical people, but it would have
made for some interesting entertainment on a couple of fronts.

<snip>


<snip><snip><snip> of a dozen unnecessary trailers

===================================
This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com

View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com
Dean Cleaver
2007-02-14 02:19:44 UTC
Permalink
phil paxton
2007-02-14 11:54:01 UTC
Permalink
On 2/13/07, Dean Cleaver <***@xceptionsoftware.com> wrote:

> My TimeZones collection populates from the TimeZone information Windows
> has in the registry. If the wacky timezone is in there, my classes will
> load it in. There's also nothing to stop you from populating my timezone
> classes yourself (I did publish full source) from another source if
> desired.

Thanks!

It sounds like a winner to me!!

(Now where were we before I derailed the train?)

phil

===================================
This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com

View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com
Mark Aurit
2007-02-14 18:12:35 UTC
Permalink
I have an app which displays data from a database in html pages. So far
so good. But instead of using the textbox to gather the data, I
embedded a rich text control in an application (freetextbox.org). Ive
rued the day ever since, because users just love to cut and paste from
excel and word tables, which generate the most excruciating html,
tossing the display off and doing other ugly things.

Now that Ive shown the customers Paris I cant take them back to the
asp:textbox Kansas. Freetextbox has "cleanup" functionality, but I dont
particularly trust it - and it assumes users click on the "cleanup"
icon, which of course isnt guaranteed.

Has anyone else had this issue? Any solutions?

Thanks, Mark

P.S. If anyone is planning on using such a control, I strongly
recommend you thoroughly test out the html it generates. The first such
control I used actually generated its own weird html. Im embarrassed to
say I dont catch it for some time.

--
====================
Mark Aurit
***@gmail.com

===================================
This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com

View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com
Christopher Frazier
2007-02-14 18:28:25 UTC
Permalink
http://www.google.com/search?q=htmltidy

--
-Christopher
| AspInsider
http://chrisfrazier.net/blog

(\__/)
(='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your
(")_(") signature to help him gain world domination.

-----Original Message-----
From: Discussion of building .NET applications targeted for the Web
[mailto:DOTNET-***@DISCUSS.DEVELOP.COM] On Behalf Of Mark Aurit
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2007 12:13 PM
To: DOTNET-***@DISCUSS.DEVELOP.COM
Subject: [DOTNET-WEB] Rich text box fear and loathing

I have an app which displays data from a database in html pages. So far
so good. But instead of using the textbox to gather the data, I
embedded a rich text control in an application (freetextbox.org). Ive
rued the day ever since, because users just love to cut and paste from
excel and word tables, which generate the most excruciating html,
tossing the display off and doing other ugly things.

Now that Ive shown the customers Paris I cant take them back to the
asp:textbox Kansas. Freetextbox has "cleanup" functionality, but I dont
particularly trust it - and it assumes users click on the "cleanup"
icon, which of course isnt guaranteed.

Has anyone else had this issue? Any solutions?

Thanks, Mark

P.S. If anyone is planning on using such a control, I strongly
recommend you thoroughly test out the html it generates. The first such
control I used actually generated its own weird html. Im embarrassed to
say I dont catch it for some time.

--
====================
Mark Aurit
***@gmail.com

===================================
This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com

View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com

--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.441 / Virus Database: 268.17.39/686 - Release Date: 2/14/2007
7:54 AM


--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.441 / Virus Database: 268.17.39/686 - Release Date: 2/14/2007
7:54 AM


===================================
This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com

View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com
Rich Armstrong
2007-02-14 14:49:03 UTC
Permalink
Dean Cleaver
2007-02-14 02:17:35 UTC
Permalink
phil paxton
2007-02-13 20:44:43 UTC
Permalink
On 2/13/07, Mark Aurit <***@gmail.com> wrote:
> I suppose the corporation I work for is not unlike everyone elses -
> there is some major paranoia going on with dst.
> Im working on an app that uses some calendar controls, just brought one
> up in vs.net 2.5 - and noticed an "IsDaylightSavings" property. Please
> tell me this wont be an issue - both at the ide and framework level. Im
> hoping neither use internal algorithms, instead depending on the OS.
> That makes it someone else's problem (whether one exists or not).

Until last year, the trivia question of, "What three states don't
observe Daylight Savings Time" was answered "Indiana, Arizona, and
Hawaii".

Indiana always had a few counties near Chicago, Cincinnati, and
Louisville stay in tune with those cities. The nice thing in
mainframe days was to set the boxes to be Z-5 and never touch it.

The Indiana State Legislature was receiving more & more pressure each
year by businesses[1] to affirm that stance or switch. The biggest
point was it would screw businesses[2] up because six months of the
year, we be (in my terms) "Chicago time" the other, "New York Time".
In addition to the State Legislature's passing, the Federal Gov't had
to do a bunch of legwork as well. The decision was made to go Eastern
(New York) time and any counties which wanted to go back to Central
could do so. Any county which touched a state line or touched a county
which had already stated their intentions[3] (That would be a fun ACM
Programming problem to deal with) and I don't think everyone
understand just how complex that could be.

The bottom line? DST exists pretty much everywhere except for Arizona
and Hawaii and only a handful of Indiana counties.
_________________________________________


[1] This was the easiest way to explain it to people because trying to
give a two minute tutorial re: time zones, etc. It was just as easy
to say, "We're on 'Chicago Time' right now." I started doing that
back when I was in the arena of publishing computer books and have
since continued the practice.

[2] Many years ago, farmers tried the argument, "It'll screw up the
cows and cost us money." No one figured out a carefully worded
argument, but [as for me] having spent a *long* time on a couple of
farms, anyone trying that argument with me was met with, "Can you show
me the clock in your barn the cows use?"

[3] That would be a fun ACM Programming problem to deal with. They
still don't allow recursion, do they?

===================================
This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com

View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com
Brian Vallelunga
2007-02-13 19:18:02 UTC
Permalink
Lizet Pena de Sola
2007-02-13 19:27:08 UTC
Permalink
Dean Cleaver
2007-02-13 19:45:35 UTC
Permalink
brian zinn
2007-02-13 19:55:42 UTC
Permalink
For my last project I ran cruisecontrol.net continuous integration, we
didn't use QA or a staging environment for most releases. Consider that we
had high code coverage and confidence in our changes, although that's not a
proper replacement for QA or staging.

Although it was a mission critical application - it was also internal, which
is probably a luxury you don't have. We simply xcopied all of the files for
deployment! Each site version was stored on the webserver for roll-backs
(along with sql scripts, if necessary). Our stored procedures were in
subversion, so we can link them to specific releases. If you're worried
about uptime consider a webfarm and some type of session management not tied
into the web server. Even updates to web.config will cause IIS to recycle.

If your sites are "updated almost constantly" then I think that is generally
a problem in itself... since you're in charge of the project you should try
to limit that to scheduled releases if possible. Sorry, but I'm just having
trouble visualizing a site that needs to be constantly updated, yet is well
managed!

Cheers,
Brian Z

On 2/13/07, Brian Vallelunga <***@vallelunga.com> wrote:
>
> This would be a really great plan if it weren't impossible for us. Our
> sites are updated almost constantly with very few scheduled large
> releases. I think we could use something more along the lines of a
> continuous integration and deployment system. What about other people
> out there?
>
> Brian
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Discussion of building .NET applications targeted for the Web
> [mailto:DOTNET-***@DISCUSS.DEVELOP.COM] On Behalf Of Lizet Pena de Sola
> Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2007 9:21 AM
> To: DOTNET-***@DISCUSS.DEVELOP.COM
> Subject: Re: [DOTNET-WEB] Deployment Strategies
>
> We usually build set up projects for the projects in the solution. The
> deployment team in our case has nothing to do with the developers, and
> the developers do not have access to the production servers. So in order
> to make the deployment process easier and painless, we create a set up
> project for every project that needs to be elevated individually. For
> instance, one for the web services project, another one for the web
> project, another one for the intranet web project, etc. It mainly
> depends on where these projects will be deployed. When we create the
> build that will be elevated we label the files on that version in the
> source control system as, for instance, "deployed in V1.2.3"...
> Hope this helps,
> Lizet
>
> ===================================
> This list is hosted by DevelopMentor(r) http://www.develop.com
>
> View archives and manage your subscription(s) at
> http://discuss.develop.com
>

===================================
This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com

View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com
Lizet Pena de Sola
2007-02-13 21:59:26 UTC
Permalink
Efran Cobisi
2007-02-14 08:05:42 UTC
Permalink
In our team we use and love SubVersion [1] version control system;
generally, in our solutions we have a set of environment we maintain
(development/local, staging and production) and tag each solution build
after it is published into one of them. The content is published using a
very simple content management system, based on a SQL Server 2005 database.
SubVersion alone, btw, is not so smart to merge changes occured in the
same page; so, trying to use ASP.NET 2.0 master pages and to separate
the logic of your web site into different components and controls will
help you avoid page level conflicts. For everything else (almost),
SubVersion really helped us.

[1] http://subversion.tigris.org/

HTH,

Efran Cobisi
http://www.cobisi.com

Brian Vallelunga wrote:
> I'm being put in charge of a fairly good sized web site and a small team
> of developers. I'm trying to develop a strategy for organizing the
> submission of new web site code and content and then distribution to the
> live site. I'm curious what other people have found as best practices in
> these areas.
>
> We have a staging server and are currently using Vault as our source
> code repository. Right now we're using ASP.NET 1.1, but will be moving
> to 2.0 in the near future. This brings with it another set of questions.
>
> I've had quite a bit of experience developing sites, but generally with
> only one or two people at a time. Now we're likely to have four or five
> managing the content. It's also not likely we'll have set releases, but
> instead will have to be dealing with small changes occurring frequently
> and in different parts of the page.
>
> So what do people do in this sort of situation? How do you get your
> files where they need to be without having everyone step on each other's
> toes?
>
> Thanks,
> Brian
>
> ===================================
> This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com
>
> View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com
>

===================================
This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com

View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com
Simpson, Nick
2007-02-14 16:05:20 UTC
Permalink
Hi Brian,

I think deployment strategies partially go hand in hand with development
strategies. Some suggestions.

(1) Assign responsibilities for different sections of the site to specific
people e.g. dev1 (Browse), dev2 (Search), dev3 (Checkout). This makes it
easier to coordinate development and prevent toe-stepping during development
and build.

(2) Use partial classes as a means of reducing code contention where more
than one developer is working on the same class. These are a new feature of
.NET 2 and allow you to split a class across multiple files. I wouldn't do
this too much but when needed these can be checked out and worked on by
different people.

(3) Centralise your builds through one person with a backup if they're away.
Give advance notice of build time and require developers work to be all
checked-in, buildable, and to some extent tested by a specific time. From
this time you put a halt on code-progression until you are happy with the
build. We usually deploy to a dev server and all double-check our work then.
The only code-progression at that stage is to fix bugs that are as a result
of code changes since the last build.

(4) Under normal circumstances builds should happen weekly or fortnightly at
the most. Any more frequently is too disruptive to being productive and
getting things done. Just after a major code release you may need to build
more frequently but if you need to do this all the time it's probably an
indication of a buggy system that just needs you to have a good patch of
dedicated time to sort it out, or a system that has elements that could best
be dealt with by some form of content management i.e. sticking it in the DB
and letting someone non-technical manage it.

I think this sometimes can be just about organisation. A good task tracker
like FogBugz helps for this sort of thing so you can tell what's going into
a particular build and what everyone's been up to.

Hope that helps in some way.

Nick

-----Original Message-----
From: Discussion of building .NET applications targeted for the Web
[mailto:DOTNET-***@DISCUSS.DEVELOP.COM] On Behalf Of Brian Vallelunga
Sent: 13 February 2007 02:32
To: DOTNET-***@DISCUSS.DEVELOP.COM
Subject: [DOTNET-WEB] Deployment Strategies

I'm being put in charge of a fairly good sized web site and a small team of
developers. I'm trying to develop a strategy for organizing the submission
of new web site code and content and then distribution to the live site. I'm
curious what other people have found as best practices in these areas.

We have a staging server and are currently using Vault as our source code
repository. Right now we're using ASP.NET 1.1, but will be moving to 2.0 in
the near future. This brings with it another set of questions.

I've had quite a bit of experience developing sites, but generally with only
one or two people at a time. Now we're likely to have four or five managing
the content. It's also not likely we'll have set releases, but instead will
have to be dealing with small changes occurring frequently and in different
parts of the page.

So what do people do in this sort of situation? How do you get your files
where they need to be without having everyone step on each other's toes?

Thanks,
Brian

===================================
This list is hosted by DevelopMentor(r) http://www.develop.com

View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com

===================================
This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com

View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com
Brian Vallelunga
2007-02-15 00:12:17 UTC
Permalink
David Cameron
2007-02-15 00:29:41 UTC
Permalink
> As for source control, we currently use Vault. The system is set up in
> such a way that the deployed files are actually set as a working copy of
> a Vault project. After files are checked in they are updated on the live
> server by getting the latest copy. This system works ok, but I think
> there's got to be a better way. One benefit of this is that if a file
> takes down the site, it can be quickly reverted to the prior version.
> I've used Subversion on previous projects and am unsure of the relative
> merits of the two.

One feature of subversion that might be very useful is merge. If you
have multiple people working on the same code, particularly on the same
file, the changes can be merged.

Something else that might make life a little easier is to create a job
to pull out the latest version from your VCS at a known interval (eg
overnight or at 12pm and 12am). That way your updates can be regular but
people will also be aware that they need to have everything working by a
deadline.

regards
David Cameron

===================================
This list is hosted by DevelopMentor® http://www.develop.com

View archives and manage your subscription(s) at http://discuss.develop.com
Continue reading on narkive:
Loading...